The Westside Writer's Schmooze Interrupts Your Traditional Ideas on Publishing With a Look at Non-Traditional Publishing Paths

We like to think of ourselves as a family here at the Westside Writers Schmooze. So when it came time to chinwag about the new ways of getting your book out there in the Alternative Publishing chapter of our Ground-Breaking Year-Long Concept-Schmooze Experiment: The Journey Of Your Book:, we looked within.

We started with ol’ Grandpa.  Ten years ago, Writer-Actor-Westside Schmoozer Eric Drachman began publishing his own picture books with audio (apparently they came with something called “CDs”). And when we say publishing we mean really publishing: He wrote, edited, designed, hired and directed artists, found cheap high quality printers for the book, and took care of all the promotion and distribution himself, as well as producing, directing, casting and acting in the audio versions of each book. 

These truly beautiful picture books sold really well (700,000 and still going—you can still get them here: kidwick.com). When asked what possessed him to take on such a gargantuan and seemingly impossible task (keep in mind, this was before “Print-On-Demand” was even a twinkle in Jeff Bezo’s eye), Eric said he did it because he felt the audio part of his books was integral to his vision and the publishing world wouldn’t have been interested. Now Grandpa Eric was a tough ol’ bird; not everybody has the stamina or the talent to just up and turn themselves into a full fledged publisher. But back in the late 80’s, that was just the way his generation was raised.

 

Lazy Cousin Greg is another matter. Also a longtime Schmoozer, Greg Pincus was more interested in getting his poems out there than in becoming another Simon or Shuster. In 200,6 he started one of the early literary blogs for his whimsical funny poems (gottabook), releasing one a week. He soon developed a following big enough to draw the attention of the New York Times. They did a feature article on him that got the interest of Arthur A. Levine, who then signed Greg to write a novel (the recently released The 14 Fibs of Gregory K). 

During the long process of birthing that book, Greg felt a need to also release a book of his poems. Greg wanted to see how e-books and self publishing worked, so he chose the poems he wanted to release, and then went to the website “fiver.” There, he hired someone to help him format his book. Not long after, he released The Late Bird. Greg said it was a great experience and hopes to do a few more poetry books in the next few years. He loves that its price is just $2.99 and that it will never go out of print!

Every family has some crotchety old kook building who-knows-what in his barn, and the Westside Writers Schmooze is no different. Cranky Uncle Jeff Cox decided he wanted to make an e-book from his picture book story Myna and Tumbu. He had already found an artist he loved to illustrate his book, and he knew it would be hard to find a publisher with an artist in tow. But instead of using the half-baked pre-made software tools available at the time (a few years ago), Jeff decided to learn Kindle’s programming language and do it himself. 

That journey was full of challenges (including Kindle’s changing their whole language a week before his book’s original release date) but he now not only has a great book out on Amazon (buy it HERE), he knows how to program any book for it. Just like Grandpa Eric used his acting chops to set his books apart, Uncle Jeff used his nerdtastic computer skills to take on the publishing world.

Half-Brother Joshua Hauke used to be a constant presence at the Westside Writers Schmooze but we don’t see him as often anymore because he’s so busy servicing his Tales of the Brothers Three online comic empire. His story started when Charlie’s agent at the time (more years ago than Charlie cares to remember) rather rudely dissed Josh’s first attempts at a comic book.  Rather than get depressed and take to his bed (Charlie’s preferred response to adversity) Josh just decided, “Screw her!” and began putting his comics online. 

Josh dove headfirst into promotion including social media, comic conventions, school visits and even stalking events with similar audiences to the one he was seeking. His ultimate goal was to “create an audience” for his comic, and it must have worked because now he has three print-on-demand books (order them at  ) as well as a huge following online. For his part, Charlie has no book and his former agent and he have parted ways. But he’s not bitter. Because that would be wrong.

The one negative(ish) story of self publishing from the night was from recent addition Schmoozer, Long Lost Sister Jodi R. Moore (http://jrrothman.wix.com/jodirmoore. Jodi decided to self-publishing her book Let’s Face It when her agent didn’t feel it was ready to go out yet. At the time, Jodi disagreed and decided to release it herself. Looking back, she wishes she’d been a little more patient.

That said, she did open up a venue for her work (she’s self-published a second book, Dallas Lalone: In Our Words as well) and has learned about the publishing game from the inside out. In addition to learning to wait until the book is truly as good as it can be, Jodi questions whether it’s harder to sell YA books independently than it is picture books.

Our longtime Hippie Cousin, Paula McMath (paulamcmath.comcouldn’t make it to the Schmooze (she was off hiking the Appalachian trail with some primo bud—her husband), but she sent a wonderful explanation of how she took her birthday song, Very Happy Day, and turned it into an app! It started as an idea for a book with audio, like Grandpa Eric used to do.

And, like he did, she found traditional publishers were put off by the audio component. But instead of tying her wagon to the old world of paper, Paula moved on to the world of apps where she found a slew of exciting of possibilities. Now she could allow the user (what app people call readers) to choose the gender of the main character, play the song with or without vocals, record their own vocals over the music, and even play interactive games. Her takeaway: “In a nutshell — a seeming ‘limitation’ has sent me into a more interactive and multi-layered approach to realizing the project.”  You can’t get her app yet, but it will soon be available at the apple App store for iphone and ipad.

Lastly, little sister Cassandra Federman who couldn’t stay up late enough for this month’s Schmooze, sent us a passel of great links for more info on alternative publishing:

A comparison of Amazon’s Create Space with Ingram Spark Print On Demand and Author: http://www.selfpublishingadvice.org/watchdog-ingram-spark-vs-createspace-for-self-publishing-print-books/ -

http://www.authorly.com/ 

Some great Joanna Penn Podcasts interviewing self published kid-book authors: http://www.thecreativepenn.com/2014/01/14/books-for-children-karen-inglis/

http://www.thecreativepenn.com/2015/01/19/kindle-kids-book-creator/

NOTE: the first podcast is a bit of a downer. The second one gives us all hope!

And so much more. But Crazy Cousin Karol, the Cat lady who lives up the block, and spent the whole night fuming about these kids with their newfangled ideas, ended the evening sticking up for the power of traditional publishing with a surprisingly powerful and emotional note. She said she’s holding out for a traditional publisher for her YA novel Cursed, about a thirteen year old girl newly diagnosed with a painful, embarrassing chronic illness, because she wants the book’s audience to know that “their story” is important enough to merit a “real” book. 

That made a lot of sense, even to Charlie. His takeaway was that the value of publishing, whether self or traditional, really depended on what you were hoping to get out of it. Book writing is rarely lucrative, so authors should follow their own unique paths to their audiences.

Whew! That’s it. As well it should be, don’t you think?

Except - we just HAVE to share this awesome notes + sketch by Schmoozer Carol Green, who co-coordinator Karol thinks captured her likeness marvelously!

Be sure to join us Wednesday, May 13^th as The journey continues with From Book Launches to School Visits, Promoting and Supporting Your Book.

Until the, keep passing the open windows!

Charlie & Karol

What to Expect When You're Expecting...the Recap on the Westside Writers AWESOME New Authors Panel!

This month, Schmooze Central hands the reins over to the delightful Cassandra Federman.  Take it away, Cassandra!!

On Wednesday March 11^th, the Westside Writers Schmooze spoke with five published (that’s right, PUBLISHED) authors! Our panelists included:

-       Edith Cohn – Middle Grade Author, Sprit’s Key

-       Nicole Maggi – YA Author, The Forgetting and Winter Falls, (First book in the Twin Willows Trilogy)

-       Kirk Jay Mueller – Picture Books Author, Harriet Can Carry It

-       Sue Ganz Schmitt – Picture Book Author, Planet Kindergarten, The Princess and the Peanut, and Even Superheroes Get Diabetes

-       Tracy Holczer – Middle Grade Author, The Secret Hum of a Daisy

Interesting side note:  by way of a super-happy coincidence, the five authors participating in the panel had vastly different experiences on their paths to getting published.

Let’s begin the Q & A!

(Disclaimer: Answers are paraphrased and should not be considered direct quotes.)

How did you all get your agents? And how did you know they were right for you?

EC – Has had three agents.  As she improved her writing, she “upgraded” her agents.

She used Publishers Marketplace to see who was selling Middle Grade books well. The top 10 MG agents were her targets!

            “Go to workshops!” She met her current rep through the Highlights Foundation Whole Novel Workshop.

NM – Has had the same agent for 10 years! Nicole’s agent helped her discover her voice as a YA author. They met at the Historical Novel Society Conference. She also recommended attending conferences, “They help you get off the slush pile.”

KJM – Doesn’t have an agent. He went to publishers directly and made sure to cite his experience as a teacher for over 30 years. (Use whatever edge you have!)

He made the mistake of sending out his manuscript before it was ready. It got rejected. Then he reworked it, selected 4 more publishing houses, and got it published by Star Bright Books.

Now his book is in Barnes and Noble and Kirk is over the moon!

SGS – Self-published two books on her own: The Princess and the Peanut and Even Superheroes Get Diabetes. She worked in marketing for years and knew she could sell these books without an agent because they had a niche market. (That’s the best situation for self-publishing. Make sure to have a niche book, then go to the big companies involved in that niche and sell lots of copies to them!)

For her third book, Planet Kindergarten, Sue wanted an agent. She reached out to friends over social media. That didn’t work out great. Then she selected 40 agents and reached out to them. That failed too. She reached out again over social media and finally struck gold. “Don’t give up!”

TH – After years of writing, she finally wrote a book that matched her taste. It was at that point she knew she could reach out to agents.

            She searched SCBWI for blog posts, interviews, and anything that had to do with agents. She read and researched A LOT!

She also used Query Tracker to make sure she targeted the agents that were right for her book.

            “Timing and luck is a big part of when you sell.”

What was it like when an offer was made?

Schmoozers listen with rapt attention to
the stories of the "big moment."

EC – Just got an email. The book had been on submission for 4 months.

She controls how much info her agent gives her about where they are in the submission process. She doesn’t want to hear if her book is getting rejected or if it is close to going to acquisitions. She only wants good news once it is definite.

“GOING TO ACQUISITIONS” is when editors take the book to their bosses and sell them on the idea. Oftentimes the book goes to committee (editorial committee) first, then to acquisitions, where they discuss the potential sales and marketing.

NM – Winter Falls was on submission for 6 months before they decided to go with a smaller press called Medallion Media. Medallion bought the first book in the trilogy. They bought the second and third soon after.

The Forgetting was only on submission for 2 months.

Agents send the book out to all their connections first, then to smaller presses. If it doesn’t sell, then you and your agent may decide to discuss self-publishing.

KJM – Got an email directly, since he had no agent. He cautions writers to make sure their manuscript is as good as it can be before sending it out and burning contacts.

SGS – Made sure to retain all Film/TV rights in her contract, as she wants her book to become a TV series.

TH – Got an email informing her of the two-book deal. When your agent recommends a deal, you take it (however you feel about two-book deals). Doesn’t mind hearing about rejections.

How much editing and adjusting do your agents/editors do? What’s the editing process like and how much time do you get for revisions?

EC – Got big picture adjustments first and was given one month. Then went through 5 more turnarounds, each allowing 2-3 weeks for changes.

NM – Got 3 weeks to turnaround The Forgetting, then it was done!

Winter Falls had already gone through 18 months of notes with another publishing company before the book was dropped and it went to Medallion. Not many adjustments were needed at that point because so much had already been done.

KJM – Only got notes on specific words, but no major changes.

SGS – Agent helped with some minor edits. Once they got an offer, she went through 2 more months of editing.

TH – Agent helped with big picture edits. First edit was 11 pages of notes from her editor, and she was given 3 months to turn it around. The editor helped with small details over the course of two more large-scale edits. Then it went to copyedits (to check for typos, facts, consistency of rules in your story, etc.)

COPY EDITING is the last place authors can make major changes to their books. After copy editing comes FIRST PASS PAGES, usually given to the author in PDF format. Once authors get these pages, they cannot make big changes because the book is formatted for printing purposes. Typos can be fixed, but nothing can be done that would extend text onto a new line.]

How did you end up with your illustrators? How did that process work?

KJM – Sent his publisher a DETAILED list of art notes, which he didn't know was a major faux pas. He is grateful they chose the amazingly talented artist, Sarah Vonthron-Laver, whose illustrations are absolutely wonderful! 

SGS – Received a list of potential illustrators to choose from. Since she wants her book become a TV series, she selected an illustrator who was also an animator. The one she chose wasn’t available for 7 years, so she suggested an illustrator/animator that she’d met at an SCBWI conference. He was available and it worked out!

EC – Got a say in her cover artist. She liked the artist who did Doll Bones and they were able to get her. (The artist, Eliza Wheeler, is a member of SCBWI right here in LA!)

Tell us about the marketing process. How much do you have to do and how much does the publicist help?

EC – Your editor sometimes helps get blurbs from other authors you wouldn’t otherwise be able to get. Blurbs are very important and helpful to new authors.

They are great to have for promotion if your trade reviews take awhile to come.

Fall is the worst time for a debut author’s book to come out. They get overlooked, as it is the time of year when well-known authors release their books. It is also harder to get blurbs from other authors at this time.

Our esteemed panelists - many thanks!

NM – Publishers send out ARCs (Advanced Reader Copy) to get reviews and blurbs.

KJM – Does presentations at various schools, since he has lots of connections there. His publishing Company, Star Bright Books, is on the East Coast, and has been very supportive and helpful by marketing and promoting his book worldwide.

SGS – “The amount of promotion/marketing you have to do with a self-published book and a traditionally published book is the same, except with traditionally published books, they take care of all the big stuff.”

She did a flashmob book launch at Barnes and Noble!

            She also created a book trailer by hiring someone off of Fiverr.com, a FANTASTIC marketing tool! “You can hire anyone on there to create something for you for only five dollars.” Make sure you draw up a contract and retain the rights of whatever you have created.

NM – Smaller houses can be great for marketing. They have fewer books and you receive more attention from the publicist.

TH – Told her publicist that she was going to the ALA (American Library Association conference) with her debut group, and they offered a signing at the Penguin Booth. It’s definitely worth asking for these types of events even if it’s not part of the official publicity campaign. She paid for it herself, but they loved the idea.

            Follow the Nerdy Book Club on Twitter. They are an influential group of librarians and teachers!

All the authors print their own postcards, business cards, and other marketing materials. “Build a good relationship with the poor, overworked publicists!” Help them by self-promoting and coming up with inventive ways they can help you! You want them to love you!

That about wraps up the Published Authors Q & A.  Hopefully, you learned more about the process of publication and picked up some useful tools for the future!

Cassandra Federman

HUGE thanks to (the really rather lovely, doncha think?) Cassandra Federman  taking copious notes during the panel and somehow wrangling an amazing amount of info into this blog post! Charlie had to take to his bed even thinking about the effort involved. And when he saw how concise and informative her writing was, he seriously considered a move to Borneo. However, given that this would have required him figuring out where Borneo was, he chose instead to roll over and go back to sleep until the next schmooze.

Be sure to join us for the next Schmooze on Wednesday April 15^th where—

We Interrupt Our Traditional Publishing Trajectory…

            --We’ll explore eBooks, aps, self-publishing and other new-fangled and fabulous ways of getting to your readers.

***PLEASE NOTE:  The April’s Schmooze has been pushed to 3^rd week due to Passover.  This in no way implies that the fact that it is both Charlie and Karol’s birthday month should be “passed over.”

Until then, keep passing the open windows,

Charlie & Karol (…and Cassandra!)

Diary of a Wimpy Schmooze Coordinator (AKA The Westside Writers Novel Critique Schmooze Recap)

February 11, 2015—2:57 PM

Man, I am so burned out on this whole annual novel critique thing. If I wasn’t co-coordinator I’d probably just skip it. I mean, it’s fine for young, productive people who still have hopes and dreams; real writers who manage to move from one project to the next instead of working on the same stupid book for more years than I even want to admit. Am I really going to bring those same 4 pages? Sure, I’ve done some revising since last year but really, what’s the point? Those pages have been polished so many times it’ll just be everyone saying how much they like them, and I’ll puff up, start pontificating and forget that my real problems are later and structural until I get home and realize what happened and start to hate myself for the whole big ego thing… On the other hand, if I don’t bring anything, I’ll really feel like a loser who can’t even put himself on the line when he’s asking everyone else to—I mean what’s wrong with me? What’s WRONG with me?

Maybe I’ll call Karol and tell her I’m under the weather….

February 12, 2015—12:32 AM

That was great! I’m so glad Karol didn’t let me wuss out (though she didn’t have to be so mean about it). First of all, there were so many new writers there. Of the 26 people attending it seemed like a third of them were newbies. And then, at my table at least, they were all really talented. Everyone had different and amazing stories (many with a strain of animalism that was fascinating), and everyone really listened, hungry for useful criticism. Even better, the comments were all pretty deep and thoughtful. As for my stupid pages, it kinda started out like I said, with me pontificating. But then I reminded myself to shut up and listen, and I found out about some very clear missteps in my first paragraph that implied my main character was younger than he is. A few Schmoozers had a global idea that, while interesting, doesn’t really work given the nature of the book. Still in all, it was a great and revealing night, and everyone there seemed to find it as much fun as I did.

February 21, 2015---3:00 PM

Just got back from a bike ride and somewhere along Mulholland I realized that the Schmoozer’s global idea was actually terrific and solves some of my structural problems. It doesn’t quite work the way they suggested it, but with a bit of tweaking, it’s freaking brilliant! I don’t know why I thought I was burned out on SCBWI. It’s awesome! 

February 21, 2015—3:37 PM

Ugh! I am so burned out on SCBWI! While I was in the shower, Karol left a message asking if I’d take the lead on this month’s blog (since she’s taken the lead on the last two and she’s busy setting up the panel for next month’s Schmooze).  I mean—I love going, I love leading it and I love talking. But why do I have to have responsibilities? And anyway, what’d she do for last month's blog? Just got a lot of people to write in what they thought.  Of course, that required effort too, with emailing and such. Hmm, how can I get out of this…?

Ha!  I know!! I’ll just publish this stupid journal, unedited! And then, at the end invite everyone to tell about their experiences at their own tables in the “Comments” section!  Problem solved! 

Oh, I am good!!  Now it’s off to revise my book, which I’m oddly excited to do—gotta love SCBWI!

 ...There you have it Schmoozers - a scary look into the tortured (yet somehow lovable) mind of one of your "fearful" leaders.

We have an AMAZING Schmooze planned for March 11:

What To Expect When You’re Expecting (A Best-Selling Book To Magically Appear on Bookstore Shelves/eReaders)

             -- A panel of first time authors will take us through the various steps in the publication process, from receiving an offer through the book’s release.

Seriously, you do NOT want to miss this one...or ANY one, really.

Until the, keep passing the open windows,

Charlie & Karol

[Insert creative and pithy title for the Westside Writers Schmooze picture book critique recap here]

Karol:  Ah, crap, Charlie.  It’s time for another critique night recap.

Charlie:  Um, is it?

Karol:  YES, Charlie.  What are we supposed to do?  I mean, we really knocked it outta the park with our first one in 2012 (http://socalschmooze.blogspot.com/2012/02/once-upon-time-westside-writers.html)

Charlie:  2012!?  Have we been at this for THAT long?

Karol:  Yup.  2013’s recap was pretty creative, too (http://socalschmooze.blogspot.com/2013/04/straight-from-schmoozers-mouths.html).  But then last year, though the PBC Schmooze with the “illustrators in Residence” gimmick was pretty spectacular, we totally phoned in the blog with a 3-Schmooze recap FIVE months after the fact (http://socalschmooze.blogspot.com/2014/08/westside-writers-schmooze-finishing-out.html)

Charlie:  Yeah, but it had that cool gif from The Shining!

Karol:  Focus, Charlie.  What are we gonna do?  How can we possibly phone it in any more than we already have in the past?

Charlie:  Hit up a few Schmoozers to write little blurbs about their experiences at the PBC Schmooze and “call it a blog”…?

Karol:  OMG – that’s brilliant!!

Charlie:  Sloth and avoidance don’t just happen, Karol.  You have to work at them.

GREETINGS lovely Schmooze Blog readership! We present to you now our recap of the Picture Book Critique Schmooze (through the eyes of its participants):

We give you the Picture Book Critique Schmooze through the eyes of the participants:

 I was ready to query. My manuscript had been revised and noted and re-revised and re-noted...and, well, you get the idea. What could my fellow critiquers say except, “Brilliant! I hope you’ve already started querying with such a masterpiece on your hands!”

           

They will say it’s too long! It’s wayyyy too long! QUIET down voice in the back of my mind! I keep telling you, it’s ready to go!

           

So, what did my fellow Schmoozers say? It was awesome! ... And long. Wayyyy too long to submit for queries. Then they helped me figure out what to trim so I could keep the heart of my work intact. They gave me the objectivity that I needed after having been with the story for so long.

           

Since the critique, I’ve been able to cut my manuscript nearly in half. And today, I finally sent out those queries! We shall see how it goes, but at least I know I’ve sent out something that even the voice in the back of my mind is proud of.

           

Sometimes you just need some really smart people to tell you what you refuse to hear. Thanks SCBWI Westside Schmooze!­­

--Cassandra Federman
http://www.cassandra-federman.squarespace.com/

http://www.scbwi.org/members-public/cassandra-federman

As my first ever in-person critique, the experience was immensely valuable.

There are obvious benefits to receiving constructive feedback from your peers. For instance, in hearing my story read aloud, I keyed into weaknesses that I’d missed during my own readings (and re-readings). The group called out additional spots needing repair, and together we brainstormed on possible solutions. This process was made painless by the care everyone took to be supportive and kind in their recommendations.

Getting a notebook full of suggestions was great, but the second (and my favorite) benefit was learning where my writing was already successful. My group pointed out exactly which lines were

strong and connected with them. This gave me a glimpse of what good writing can achieve and encouraged me to keep revising.

Perhaps the least obvious benefit is the one you get when you give (rather than receive) feedback. As with reading published picture books, my group’s unique voices and fresh styles inspired me. But something else happens when you not only read but analyze a story. You get better at identifying the differences between writing that sparkles and writing that needs a polish. And this skill kicks in when you sit down to type. Giving critiques evolves your writing.

For these and many more reasons, I encourage everyone to participate in a critique Schmooze.

--Sarah Harroff

https://sardyhar.wordpress.com

My experience at the Westside Writers Schmooze Critique Group on January 14, 2015 was both exciting and rewarding. I was impressed by the strong attendance of writers and the organization of multiple tables for small groups to work together. The instructions provided before we began set the stage for a cooperative team approach.

           

The critique group I participated in consisted of five writers. Of these, four writers had picture book stories for critique. The feedback that I received was of great value. First, it was supportive of my story and writing. Secondly, it was specific in offering me new ideas to consider. The ideas were aimed at strengthening characters and story content.

           

I appreciated that the critique group writers were respectful, direct with feedback, and attentive to one another’s work.

--Frank X. Acosta

The January SCBWI LA Westside Writers' picture book critique Schmooze was wonderful.  I have to say that I was impressed and delighted by the stories shared.  This time I was at a table with pre-published as well as published authors and the quality of the feedback was excellent. Our group discussed a variety of animal stories, a fantastical tale in rhyme, and a creative nonfiction manuscript. Everyone was so supportive and everyone was so insightful and supportive.

My own manuscript had already been through several drafts and a couple of critique groups, but the writers at the Schmooze helped me to cut out even more extraneous lines. And voila! There was the perfect surprise ending for my story. It was in the manuscript the whole time, but I didn't see it until the writers at the Schmooze pointed it out. Hooray for the Schmooze!

--Andrea J. Loney 

http://andreajloney.com

http://www.scbwi.org/members-public/andrea-loney

A few grisly old-timers chimed in as well:

I always find it a useful evening. There was a teacher at our table (can't remember her name,) and she had some very insightful things to say. Also, we had an illustrator (can't remember her name, either,) and I appreciated her viewpoint, too. All in all, it's a great way to get fresh eyes on your work.

--Laurie Young

I had Greg Pincus and Andrea at my table and some other very lovely and insightful people. Off to do another rewrite. This is always a great evening. I just wished I could have heard everyone's book!

--Susan Berger

We had two newbies and two experienced writers at our table. I have to say that I was really impressed with all the work presented that evening. The incomparable Rita read each text aloud with verve and enthusiasm. I agree with Laurie - it's really helpful to writers to have a fresh eye - and ear - review your work.

--Joan Charles

What Joan said! (And thank you!) I was really impressed with the work at our table as well.

--Rita Crayon Huang

Laurie, Sue, Joan & Rita:  Who you calling grisly & old?!?!

Ooops!  Sorry.  We meant “grisly old-timers” in the sense that you’re all creative geniuses who’ve been around long enough to have thick skin and really know your stuff!

Charlie:  Do you think they’ll buy that?

Karol:  Beats me

Time for us to make our getaway!

Join us for the Novel Critique Schmooze on Wednesday, February 11^th and until then…

Keep passing the open windows,

Charlie & Karol

The Journey of Your Book Continues…with special guest, Agent Jen Rofé (JOYB Pt. 4)

Schmooze Central here.  We’ve gotten so big for our britches that we decided to have “one of the little people” step in and slave over a hot keyboard for us while we get massages (patting yourself of the back causes tight shoulder muscles…who knew?) and take meetings with Terribly Important People.

We now hand this blog post over to the lovely and talented Laurie Young (although we fully reserve the right to inset a few obnoxious asides ‘cause that’s how we roll…exhausting, we know):

The Westside Writer’s Schmooze had the pleasure of a visit from Jen Rofé at our December Schmooze who spoke on what an agent does and why a writer needs one. Her willingness and

commitment to talk to our group was very much appreciated, not just because it was during the holidays, but one week before her wedding.

Jen has been an agent with the Andrea Brown Literary Agency for over 7 years.  She represents authors and illustrators of picture books through young adult, though she admitted that middle grade is her sweet spot. Some of her most notable authors include Meg Medina, Joy Preble, Kathryn Fitzmaurice, Christina Diaz Gonzalez, and our own LA chapter’s Eliza Wheeler.

She had previously been a journalist and an editor but spent 5 years in the trenches as a middle school teacher. She loves the business side of being an agent, especially negotiating contracts and writing pitch letters.

(Schmooze Central: Yes – all the things you hate! She LOVES them!! She was BORN to this!!!)

Jen started off the evening with a list of things she doesn’t like: Horror (although psychological is fine with her), gore, and especially zombie stories. She is also not fond of music stories, and anything involving a mixtape.  (She did admit to liking Naomi and Ely’s No Kiss List…that is, until the mixtape chapter.)

Just no

To make it simple, here are her main ideas of her talk in bullet points:

(Schmooze Central:  Oooohhh!  Bullet points!  We likey! …That’s Karol. Charlie feels safer with arbitrary snippets of unrelated words implying unearned depth.)

How important is it for a kid lit writer to get an agent these days? What is the upside of having an agent?

• Contract negotiations—agents understand the boilerplate and can get you a better deal.
• Most publishing houses are closed, and editors know which agents they trust and want to work with.
• Agents advocate on your behalf and can step in to resolve conflicts.
• Authors shouldn’t have to fight with editors regarding business decisions. Agents help keep author-editor relationship clean and focused on the work.

How have you connected with the writers you sign? Where do you find your clients?

• Mostly through conferences and the AB Big Sur retreat. https://bigsurwriting.wordpress.com/
• One-on-one critiques.
•  Queries can be the last thing an agent looks at, however, Jen will open conference or workshop queries first.

How do you approach an agent at a conference?

•  Think of it as like interviewing for a job—be professional. 

What are the “no-no’s” for approaching an agent?

• Don’t be creepy. Don’t be a stalker.
• Don’t use social media to create a false sense of familiarity or use their personal information as an intro. Don’t assume a relationship just because you are “friends” on social media.
• Be professional on social media. Don’t bad mouth agents or editors.

Do you need to have a platform or blog?

• No. You can build a platform after your book is sold.
• The exception: Non-fiction. A platform is needed to show your credentials or why you are qualified to write on this topic. 

What do you look for in a query letter? (Schmooze Central:  aka Secrets to the Query Kingdom!)

• Basic format—

o      1^st paragraph: Why you chose this agent. Show clear reference, personalized, conscious decision.

o      2^nd paragraph: Jacket copy description (don’t give away ending.)

o      3^rd paragraph: Any relevant information about you.

• Keep it short, tight, professional, 1-page.
• Don’t say you are a first time writer. Don’t apologize.
• Can say if you are a teacher, but don’t say you read your work to kids and they liked it. Sounds naïve.
• Don’t write query as your character. Don’t start query with character.
• Don’t angst about the format—that said, send email to self first to check and see if it reads okay.
• Do angst about the quality of the writing.
• MOST IMPORTANT: CHECK EACH AGENT’S WEBSITE FOR SUBMISSION GUIDELINES BEFORE SENDING – AND FOLLOW THEM.

Author/illustrators: Jen will accept links to picture book dummies, but make sure your artwork is comparable to what is out there before submitting. Get feedback from conferences and workshops.

Other than great material, what other things attract you to a potential client? 

• Rapport, connection
• Similar vision for the work
• Good working relationship

Guidelines for submitting to agents? (Schmooze Central: aka (Secrets to the Kingdom of Agent Protocol!…we are ALL about snappy titles here at S.C.)

• Pick top 5-6 agents to start with and wait for a response.
• Tweak material, according to response and submit to new 5-6 agents. Repeat.
• Bad idea to submit to everyone at once—no opportunity to revise before sending out again.
• If asked for an exclusive, okay to give timeframe.
• As a courtesy, let agent know if this is a multiple submission.
• If you get an offer, as a courtesy, let other agents know before accepting. (But only an offer—no need to let other agents know if you get a request for full.)
• If an agent is interested in you and you are not excited, you should not have submitted to that agent in the first place.
• Don’t hire an illustrator for your book.

o      Waste of time and money

o      Editors will choose the illustrator

o      May hurt your chances to be considered

• Revisions can happen before rep—don’t ask for them, but be open to them. If agents want to offer advice or notes, they will.
• Holidays are a bad time of year to query. The end of the year is “wrap up” mode. You don’t want to get a rejection because an agent wants to go on vacation.
• A handful of rejections doesn’t necessarily mean you should self-pub. Revise first.
• A bad agent is worse than no agent. Make sure there is an exit policy.

Picture books:

• If you write in rhyme, make sure it is very good.
• You need to have multiple hooks.
• Query for best picture book, and then mention 2 of your other manuscripts with 1-line description of each. If an agent is interested, he or she will ask for more.
• Andrea Brown agents want at least 4 solid picture book manuscripts before taking on client.

Series:

• Can state in query that you envision book as a series. HOWEVER: Put it all into first book, don’t hold anything back.
• Series are often dictated by the publisher.

What is the etiquette for switching agents?

• Leave old agent before pursuing any new agents
• Let potential agent know if your manuscript already has been widely submitted to editors—it is likely dead. 

How long to wait for response after sending query?

• No set timeframe. Can be hours or months or longer.
• Don’t follow up with Jen. You will get an auto response, if no further response, consider that a “no.” (Schmooze Central: Re: that last part – maddening, ain’t it? But, alas, it’s the industry standard.)
• Be working on your next project!

What are typical terms for agreements between writers and children's literary agents?

• Jen uses a 1-page, straightforward agreement.
• No time frame, either party can walk away at any time. (If project is sold, it remains with agency.)
• 15% across the board, no reading fees or other fees. (Different rates for foreign and film rights.)

What happens after contract is signed?

• Revising may take a while, keep communication open.

Jen’s editing process:

o      Big picture—plot, character, elements

o      Writing tics (Schmooze Central: Everybody’s got ‘em!)

o      Doesn’t do much line editing.

• Jen makes a list of editors to submit to. Shares it with client and asks if client has any ideas.
• Submission timeframe can take hours or months or more.
• Be patient. It takes a lot of “yes’s” to make a book happen.

When you get an offer from an editor, what happens next?

• Jen discusses offer with client, asks client what is bottom line (starting offer vs. royalty rates, rights, etc.)
• Advances and royalties can range and depend on a number of factors:
• PB: 2K–15K, 5-6% of retail (split between author and illustrator)
• MG & YA: 8K+
•  Turn around: 6–12 months to finish art for book; 18 months–3 years, depending on the list, (publishers work years in advance.)

What do agents roll their eyes at?

• Neediness
• Not meeting deadlines (Schmooze Central: Ugh!  Fitzgerald never met deadlines!!)

Misc:

• You should not expect to make a living for a while.
• You do this because you want it more than anything else.
• You have to want it more than anyone. If your agent wants it more than you do, you will be dropped.

How does a writer submit material to you/what are your submission guidelines?

Click HERE for the Andrea Brown Literary Agency’s submission guidelines + plus a bonus list of great resources for writers.

…Ah, being Big Shots (even if only in our own minds) certainly does have its perks!  Thanks loads, Laurie!  (Sucker…KIDDING!)

Next up, the Journey of Your Book continues with our Picture Book Critique Schmooze on Wednesday, January 14^th.

Until then, keep passing the open windows,

Charlie & Karol (and Wonder Woman Laurie!!)

Plotting, Structure And Other Stuff The October Schmooze Kinda-Sorta Covered (The Journey of Your Book, Part II)

It was another full house at the October 8^th Schmooze, which again included a handful of first timers – woot, woot!  After announcements and introductions, we quickly got down to the business at hand – namely, how do we get from Story Spark (explored last month) to figuring out our plot and structure?

                                                    Partygoer #1:

                            Right now, it's only a notion. But I think I can get

                            money to make it into a concept.  And later turn it

                            into an idea.

                                                                  – Annie Hall

As usual, Charlie did extensive internet research.  Though some (Karol) might argue that this is merely his way of avoiding writing, others (Charlie) might argue that this is a complete misunderstanding of his process.  When tackling a new Schmooze topic, Charlie looks deep inside himself to figure out his own personal response.  Finding nothing there but desolation and despair, a barren wasteland in black and white (not unlike the end of Eric Von Stroheim’s Greed) with only a few, desiccated, dying maggots of regret, Charlie turns to the internet. 

Here’s what he found out about turning a brainstorm into a book: 

Everybody does it differently.

It’s all a matter of what works for you, what “door” you need to go through to get into your story.  For instance, a surprising number of writers favor doing your research, notes, and brainstorming and then just starting to write.  As one of them said, “Sometimes once you start with something, you kick out some more ideas whereas if you leave the idea to fester it will continue to do so.”  Others are more Karol-like in their dependence on outlining and mapping, some even saying things like, “A plot has three parts and two main transition points. T1 is the ‘epiphany moment’ where the story is moving along and something happens to change everything.  T2 is the ‘point of no return’ where something happens to force an ending either way.”  (Charlie thought T2 was just an overproduced sequel to a masterpiece.)

Charlie then tried to learn what Plato was on about in his poetics.  The main thing Charlie manage to cull from the great philosopher was the difference between plot and story:  Plot is causal.  This happened because that happened:

                        The king dies, and the queen dies – story

                        The king dies, and the queen dies of grief – plot

                                    E. M. Forester

With that, the discussion turned to structure, and Karol, being the tragically regimented gal that she is, gave a rundown on 3 Act screenplay structure, which she feels can be applied to children’s novels.  She also offered up the value of another screenwriting trope, the 12 point Beat Sheet and shared a few specific details about how creating one for her new middle grade novel helped her to figure out the plot.  In both of these structure tools, the beginning and end sections together are as long as the middle section, so a 12 point beat sheet would take a 3-6-3 format.  Charlie began to think how he never really got math and only passed geometry ‘cause Mr. Samuels took pity on him and so, lost track of the conversation.

“But what of pictures books?” Karol mused, bringing Charlie back to consciousness..  She tried her hand at creating a 4 point Beat Sheet for Green Eggs and Ham, and came up with the following (which, incidentally, amused structure-phobic Charlie to no end):

Beginning

1.     Sam I Am tries to get the narrator to try green eggs and ham, but the narrator refuses.

Middle

2.     Sam makes many suggestions of circumstances in which the narrator may like green eggs and ham; the narrator rebuffs every suggestion and adds his own examples of circumstances in which he still would not like green eggs and ham.

3.     Exasperated, the narrator agrees to try green eggs and ham if it’ll make Sam leave him alone.

End

4.     The narrator tries green eggs and ham and discovers, to his astonishment, that he likes them.

Of course, there are many tools available to help writers figure out plot and structure.  Charlie uses the outline feature in Microsoft Word heavily and brought examples to share.  And while he finds popular writing software Scrivner most helpful once he’s gotten into revisions, other writers swear by using it from start to finish.  Some writers like using real index cards (as opposed to virtual versions, like Scrivner features) to get a look at their stories physically laid out in front of them.  Starting at the end of your story and working your way backwards, making sure there’s cause-and-effect from scene to scene, is another trusted plotting exercise.

Many books, blogs and podcasts offering help with plot and structure are out there, too – from the oft-mentioned Save the Cat by Blake Snyder to 20 Master Plots (And How To Build Them) by Ronald Tobias (both technically screenwriting books but applicable to any stories) to Second Sight by Cheryl B. Klein and the Narrative Breakdown podcast (http://www.narrativebreakdown.com/). 

For writers of fantasy and otherworldly stories, Charlie and Karol asked  (perhaps cajoled is a more accurate word) Rita Crayon Huang to present some info on world building.  She began by saying that if you google “world building,” you get an exhaustive amount of info.  She turned to a trusted source for her own writing – Malinda Lo’s Five Foundations of World Building.  These include: Rules, Rituals, Power, Place and Food (yes – food!).  Read all the details here - http://www.malindalo.com/2012/10/five-foundations-of-world-building/

The discussion then moved on to The Other Stuff Your Book Kinda-Sorta Needs – and that’s a list that can be endless.  A few items on the list might be:  voice, humor, a distinct point of view, flawed but relatable character(s), character arc, antagonist, obstacles, theme, stakes, etc., etc., etc..  Different books have different requirements, and each writer is probably the best judge of what his or her own story needs.

We finished up the night with a choice of writing exercises.  Schmoozers were invited to try their hands at doing beat sheets (for both novels or picture books) or to work on “Other Stuff Brainstorming” (with the help of Karol’s trusty worksheets, which you, TOO, can use by clicking HERE.)  After rapping a bit about how the exercises went, it was time to pack up and say our goodnights. 

Based on the full houses and lively participation this month and last, it’s clear to us here at Schmooze Central that this Journey Of Your Book Year-Long Schmooze Experiment is a huge hit!  Be sure to continue the journey with us on Wednesday, November 12^th when we’ll be discussing Writing, Rewriting, Discipline And Other Loathsome Necessities.

Until then, keep passing the open windows,

Charlie & Karol